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Java Programming [Archive] - Kurt Goedel
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Posts:27,518
Registered: 11/3/97
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 9:18 AM (reply 615 of 635)



 
Most people belong to christian groups that condemn
homosexuality in one way or another.

That's too vague; have a look at this
[url=http://www.religioustolerance.org/worldrel.htm]pie
chart[/url] and see for yourself that the Christian believers are
just a minority. Maybe in the other pie pieces there
are less homo hating morons in total but that is
not something one can deduce from what you've just
said. Maybe the Christian slice carries the least
homo hating/condemning morons among all those slices,
or the most; percentage wise that is ...

Huh?

I pointed out earlier that I was discussing the US.

I also pointed out earlier that there are countries where homosexuals are jailed (and I expect more extreme punishments might exist.) The US might not be the most tolerant nation in the world, but it is far from the bottom in this regard.

See "Modern China" under this link....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_China
 

Posts:27,518
Registered: 11/3/97
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 9:21 AM (reply 616 of 635)



 
I suppose it is the phrase "congregation".

From Webster's:

4. (Anc. Jewish Hist.) The whole
body of the Jewish people; -- called also Congregation
of the Lord.

It is a sin offering for the congregation. --Lev. iv.
21.

From websters.com


1 a : an assembly of persons : GATHERING; especially : an assembly of persons met for worship and religious instruction b : a religious community: as (1) : an organized body of believers in a particular locality (2) : a Roman Catholic religious institute with only simple vows (3) : a group of monasteries forming an independent subdivision of an order
2 : the act or an instance of congregating or bringing together : the state of being congregated
3 : a body of cardinals and officials forming an administrative division of the papal curia
 

Posts:11,186
Registered: 06.04.04
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 9:49 AM (reply 617 of 635)



 
Most people belong to christian groups that
condemnhomosexuality in one way or another.

That's too vague; have a look at this
[url=http://www.religioustolerance.org/worldrel.htm]piechart[/url]

Huh?

I pointed out earlier that I was discussing the US.

You don't understand what I wrote do you? Christianity is a minority globally speaking that is.
If in the hands of the wrong person(s) the US becomes a fundamentalistic Christian country,
that'll be something to worry about.

I also pointed out earlier that there are countries where homosexuals are jailed (and I expect more
extreme punishments might exist.) The US might not be the most tolerant nation in the world, but it is far
from the bottom in this regard.

I wouldn't say 'far', I'd rather say 'near'.

See "Modern China" under this link....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_China

Well according to that link homosexual marriages are allowed in China; they've learned fast; the US
is way behind if I read that wiki page correctly ...

kind regards,

Jos

ps. I'm not attacking any person here at all, it's just that my opinion is, and the greater part of European
people, that current (and past) US government try to turn the US into a Christian fundamentalist country.
It would be a pity if they succeed.
 

Posts:4,906
Registered: 23/07/02
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 9:55 AM (reply 618 of 635)



 
From websters.com

I suggest that the definition which is illustrated by a quote from the KJV OT may be the most appropriate one when interpreting a passage from the KJV OT.
 

Posts:6,750
Registered: 1/25/04
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 10:03 AM (reply 619 of 635)



 
ps. I'm not attacking any person here at all, it's
just that my opinion is, and the greater part of
European
people, that current (and past) US government try to
turn the US into a Christian fundamentalist country.
It would be a pity if they succeed.

Is this a perception of the US government in general, or particular leaders?
 

Posts:11,186
Registered: 06.04.04
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 10:24 AM (reply 620 of 635)



 
ps. I'm not attacking any person here at all, it's just that my opinion is, and the greater part of
European people, that current (and past) US government try to turn the US into a Christian
fundamentalist country. It would be a pity if they succeed.

Is this a perception of the US government in general, or particular leaders?

In general, but some contemporary US leaders represent the quintessence of that tendency.
In Europe you can see an opposite opinion -- Aznar (Spain) lost big time at the last elections,
he's gone now; Blair keeps on losing votes. Overhere (the Netherlands) we still have to deal
with a loony prime minister but he's down the drain soon according to the polls ..

kind regards,

Jos
 

Posts:27,518
Registered: 11/3/97
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 11:06 AM (reply 621 of 635)



 
Most people belong to christian groups that
condemnhomosexuality in one way or another.

That's too vague; have a look at this
[url=http://www.religioustolerance.org/worldrel.htm]pie
hart[/url]

Huh?

I pointed out earlier that I was discussing the US.

You don't understand what I wrote do you? Christianity
is a minority globally speaking that is.
If in the hands of the wrong person(s) the US becomes
a fundamentalistic Christian country,
that'll be something to worry about.

Perhaps not. Or perhaps you do not understand what I am talking about.

In the US most of the civil charges against homosexuals are driven and supported by christian groups. The majority of my comments in this thread are directed at the US. So the global representation of religions has nothing to do with this.


I also pointed out earlier that there are countries
where homosexuals are jailed (and I expect more
extreme punishments might exist.) The US might not
be the most tolerant nation in the world, but it is far
from the bottom in this regard.

I wouldn't say 'far', I'd rather say 'near'.

No. In terms of treatment, safety, etc, the US is closer to the top.


See "Modern China" under this link....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_China

Well according to that link homosexual marriages are
allowed in China; they've learned fast; the US
is way behind if I read that wiki page correctly ...

I would suggest again that you look under the category "Modern China" in that link that I posted.

Homosexual marriages are not allowed.
 

Posts:27,518
Registered: 11/3/97
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 11:11 AM (reply 622 of 635)



 
From websters.com

I suggest that the definition which is illustrated by
a quote from the KJV OT may be the most appropriate
one when interpreting a passage from the KJV OT.

And I would suggest that interpreting the bible allows one to justify either approving or disapproving anything and thus rationalize any negative or positive bias.

This is exactly what happened with multi-racial marriages and slavery.

And given that I suspect most christians in the US do not consider working on sunday (or other designated sabbath) as a sin, despite the fact that the passage I cited indicates that God thinks it is worthy of death.

The christian groups most certainly do not strive to have laws passed to make it illegal. However at one time that was the case.

I fail to see how anyone can take the passage I cited and decide that it is not a sin nor a serious one at that, unless one chooses simply to ignore it.

And if you can ignore that one, then you can certainly ignore (and interpret differently) other parts of the bible.
 

Posts:27,518
Registered: 11/3/97
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 11:16 AM (reply 623 of 635)



 
ps. I'm not attacking any person here at all, it's
just that my opinion is, and the greater part of
European people, that current (and past) US
government try to turn the US into a Christian
fundamentalist country. It would be a pity if they
succeed.

Is this a perception of the US government in
general, or particular leaders?

In general, but some contemporary US leaders represent
the quintessence of that tendency.
In Europe you can see an opposite opinion -- Aznar
(Spain) lost big time at the last elections,
he's gone now; Blair keeps on losing votes. Overhere
(the Netherlands) we still have to deal
with a loony prime minister but he's down the drain
soon according to the polls ..

And you are suggesting that Blair an Aznar are on the outs because they supported US leaders that were trying to make the the US into a fundamental christian nation?

At least here the depiction is blamed solely on the support for the war, and I haven't noted religion being a factor (except of course for those that claimed that before the war and for that matter for the last 30-50 years.)

You wouldn't by chance have a poll or newspaper article that shows the connection to religion?
 

Posts:11,186
Registered: 06.04.04
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 11:47 AM (reply 624 of 635)



 
And you are suggesting that Blair an Aznar are on the outs because they supported US leaders that were
trying to make the the US into a fundamental christian nation?

Yep, easy as that.

At least here the depiction is blamed solely on the support for the war, and I haven't noted religion
being a factor.

Call it nationalistic blindness; temporary, I hope.

You wouldn't by chance have a poll or newspaper article that shows the connection to religion?

Google for 'Bush Blair religion' and you'll know everything you were too afraid to ask for. And besides
that, a normal application of intelligence and rational thinking makes makes anyone go 'huh?' on
this very smelly topic.

BTW, what/how do you think about these matters?

kind regards,

Jos
 

Posts:11,186
Registered: 06.04.04
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 11:55 AM (reply 625 of 635)



 
[ China ]
Homosexual marriages are not allowed.

Yep, you're right, it's forbidden in China; I apologize. In Taiwan it's legalized now and I got that mixed
up with the main land China. Nevertheless, in the US still quite a lot of loonies make money 'curing'
people from homosexuality and that Swarschenegger (sp?) doesn't do much good to the case either.
The US is becoming a Christian fundamentalist country if sensible people don't stand up ...

kind regards,

Jos
 

Posts:175
Registered: 1/20/03
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 11:56 AM (reply 626 of 635)



 
no offense to anyone, but I think I'm going to stop getting email notifications about this thread.
 

Posts:6,750
Registered: 1/25/04
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 12:04 PM (reply 627 of 635)



 
The US is becoming a Christian fundamentalist country
if sensible people don't stand up ...

Legally or socially?
 

Posts:11,186
Registered: 06.04.04
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 12:09 PM (reply 628 of 635)



 
The US is becoming a Christian fundamentalist country if sensible people don't stand up ...

Legally or socially?

Both, but more important: mentally. My 'hope' is that enough sensible folks stay awake and
keep on arguing strongly against what is happening in the US nowadays.

kiind regards,

Jos
 

Posts:27,518
Registered: 11/3/97
Re: Kurt Goedel  
Jun 14, 2004 3:41 PM (reply 629 of 635)



 

You wouldn't by chance have a poll or newspaper
article that shows the connection to religion?

Google for 'Bush Blair religion' and you'll know
everything you were too afraid to ask for. And besides
that, a normal application of intelligence and
rational thinking makes makes anyone go 'huh?' on
this very smelly topic.

I used that search string. It didn't seem to point to any polls that suggested that most people or even any one had changed their opinion lately because of some connection to the US becoming or being a fundamentalist christian nation.

BTW, what/how do you think about these matters?

What matters?
 
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